> I think your advice falls into the "much easier to say (from a great distance) than do" category.
What of it? You still don't allow people to remain in a state of slavery when it is within your power to free them with just a phone call to the police. It doesn't have to be easy to do to be unacceptable not to do.
You know, I have a life threatening genetic disorder. This is the root cause of my homelessness and the one thing I most need to get my life back is an online income adequate to support myself. I am an active participant on HN and I appear to be the top ranked woman here.
I assure you, no one on HN is valiantly trying to help me solve my financial problems. In fact, I am routinely treated dismissively by people claiming they are not being dismissive and crap like that.
Given that context, it is incredibly difficult for me to read the many remarks on HN in this thread by people claiming unequivocally that they would know the right thing to do by this woman sleeping on the kitchen floor and they would absolutely do the right thing when my experience suggests the exact opposite is probably true of most members here.
Maybe some folks could get down off their high horses and quit making me just spastic today. It would be a kindness, though probably more of a kindness than most of the incredible hypocrites here are capable of.
I'm sorry for your troubles. But being confronted, in person, with a situation that you think is domestic slavery and being asked on the internet for money by a stranger are two different things.
I'm sorry for your troubles. But being confronted, in person, with a situation that you think is domestic slavery and being asked on the internet for money by a stranger are two different things.
I am not asking for money. And you are just proving my point.
Here is another viewpoint - it's not clear what you wish for when saying
> 'I assure you, no one on HN is valiantly trying to help me solve my financial problems.'
I gather you have financial problems and are working hard to fight them. There seems to be some relation with the people on HN that don't help, but how? Did you ask for help and nobody offered? Is it sarcasm and people are actively hindering you in your job? I am confused, and I can see how someone could understand that you're asking for money. (I'm female, in case that matters.) So, I also concur that your way of expression is a bit unclear.
Or because of how you phrase things, maybe. I won't rule out that I'm prejudiced -- it's all but a certainty that I am, to some extent or another. But despite that, I don't normally think women are asking me for money on the internet.
I am the highest ranked woman on HN because women are generally not all that warmly welcomed here. So if you don't think women are asking you for money on the internet, maybe it is because you are mostly talking to men.
It is hard to ask for anything at all when silenced by the general behavior of men online. I offend in part because I fail to shut up, in spite of the sometimes horrible treatment I receive through no fault of my own.
I routinely hear men here tell each other that their high karma is evidence of competence. No one says that about me -- except me. When I say it, it gets ridiculed.
I routinely see men here ask for help with making their businesses profitable. They are not misinterpreted as begging for money. When I do it, I am accused of panhandling or ignored or it otherwise typically is not very helpful.
It would be nice if you would just stop digging your grave deeper. Your first remark was just sort of dumb. But you get more offensive with each iteration of telling me it is somehow all my fault that I can't get taken seriously no matter how hard I try, a thing I have been doing for literally years, which is part of how I ended up the highest ranked woman here.
The next closest openly female member is many, many thousands of points behind me, yet I am far from the bottom rung of the leaderboard. So all the evidence suggests that, sadly, I get taken more seriously here and get more respect than most women who basically don't bother to open their mouths, even when they have serious tech jobs.
I have many thousands more karma than the only female cofounder of Y Combinator, Jessica Livingston. She currently has 3521, which is hundreds more than she had the last time I looked. https://news.ycombinator.com/user?id=jl
You felt it was appropriate to interject in a conversation about slavery to wonder why none of these people online haven't helped you out financially, which a typical person would construe as asking for money, despite being a woman with the highest internet points (or something). Maybe I don't frequent HN enough to know who's who, but your replies to obstinate read like the ramblings of someone with mental problems (I don't mean that as an insult).
You felt it was appropriate to interject in a conversation about slavery to wonder why none of these people online haven't helped you out financially, which a typical person would construe as asking for money
No, that is not what I did. There are comments here comparing the woman sleeping on the kitchen floor to homeless people. There are multiple comments here where people are getting up on their high horse swearing that if confronted with such a situation, they would a) unequivocally know "The right thing to do" about it and b) absolutely do the right thing. They are berating this person on the internet for their moral failure in doing nothing when that individual doesn't even know the full details. But when then confronted with a homeless woman who participates here regularly, none of these supposed paragons of virtue is stepping up to valiantly go to bat for me -- which is exactly what I expected, given my long standing experience online.
No one owes me that intervention. But the people berating this guy for not automatically knowing the right answer and not immediately rescuing the woman from presumed slavery are quick to tell me I am somehow in the wrong and somehow asking for something from them when I point out the obvious example that, no, it isn't always immediately clear and obvious how to help and, no, they wouldn't valiantly rise to the occasion and feel compelled to rescue some pathetic woman from her plight just because it came to their attention like some of them are claiming.
Those are incredibly easy boasts to make when talking to some guy on the internet about his supposed moral defects. But no one here is going to back up those boasts by doing whatever it takes to extract me from my plight AND, on top of that, I am going to be inundated with accusations of mental health problems, panhandling the internet, etc for pointing out that all these supposed paragons of virtue absolutely will not have all the answers and absolutely will not go the distance involved for every case of injustice they casually trip across in the world, such as my situation.
The only thing I asked for in my remark was for people to get down off their high horses in regards to how they are talking to this guy. I am not expecting anyone to rescue me. I am only pointing out that the expectation that this individual is obligated to rescue this woman sleeping on the kitchen floor is a crazy, ridiculous expectation. Such situations are almost never solved by making a single phone call to the police and poking it at may even do enormous harm to the woman's already not enviable life.
It is easy to be a high handed braggart claiming moral high ground on the internet and trying to bully someone else into "doing the right thing" while ignoring the fact that it is rarely clear and obvious what that is and it is never easy to actually right a tremendous injustice, even when you do know all the details. Such things come at quite a high cost, if they can be pulled off at all.
> it is within your power to free them with just a phone call to the police
Maybe not. Sounds like the situation was in another country. Who knows if the police there would care or not. And applying the term "slavery" to the story in the comment is jumping to a conclusion that provides more moral clarity than there may actually be. We don't know enough to say if the situation is that of a shitty employer or that of a slaveowner, and our only source of information doesn't even know himself:
> I will talk to this friend in person next time I'm in that part of the world, which should be soon, about this incident, and get the full story of how their housekeeper lives.
I only say that to emphasize that this stuff, in reality, is probably a lot harder to deal with than some people seem to think.
> Who knows if the police there would care or not.
That's not a reason not to call.
> We don't know enough to say if the situation is that of a shitty employer or that of a slaveowner, and our only source of information doesn't even know himself:
Well, if police were to check, all the "friend" would have to do is provide proof of salary and most everything would be fine if it was a mistake.
I think you're pretty mistaken in thinking any proof would be available or required. All these maids are typically paid in cash.
Unless the person has bruises, or complains that they're not being allowed to leave---the police would ignore the situation.
Compounding this effect is that most 'maids' are distant relatives in the western sense---being 3rd cousins or nieces through marriage to the hosting family. When push comes to shove, the host family just claims truthfully that they are all a single family, and the sleeping conditions of an adult who isn't being forced to do anything is really no ones business.
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As an edit. What I'm describing is the traditional lifestyle of West African maidservants. All maids are relatives, since no one trusts anyone who isn't related to them to live in their house.
The world is a big place though. I wouldn't be surprised if maidservant lifestyles in Asian countries or Middle Eastern countries was much different.
Middle Eastern countries even use foreign-born servants, something that'd be seen as the height of insanity in someplace like Ghana.
What of it? You still don't allow people to remain in a state of slavery when it is within your power to free them with just a phone call to the police. It doesn't have to be easy to do to be unacceptable not to do.